R. thank you for all the research you do for us, and putting it on here!
We all know so little. Only partial information.
I'm going to wait till I see ALL of it. Only have parts of the "puzzle" - hard to make
an intelligent decision with only part of the facts in.

I only know... I didn't like some of the things I read regarding Z's decisions and choices.
I thought a prudent man, should have done things - differently.
When I got my gun permit, they said as I walked out "Now don't try to be a Hero!"

Whether he was "prudent" or not is not really the issue... perhaps charge him with felony imprudence?

Set a precedent like that and posters at some forums will end up serving life for First Degree Stupidity

Some who wilfully re-offend might well receive the DP

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

I do know the word "prudent" is often tossed around in the legal world. I was married to a lawyer, in another life
and heard that "test" mentioned, a lot.

That was the test sometimes ... "What would a "prudent man" do?" At least it was under PA law ... back some years.

I used it as a kind of legal term I had often heard back in the day ... during legal discussions.

Don't know if it has any relevance in FL.

http://definitions.uslegal.com/r/reason ... udent-man/

Here is a bit about what I was trying to say ...

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That's a good article, thanks for posting it. And I like the words prudent and reasonable. The very discouraging thing today is there seens to be no 'standard' for 'normal' any more. Everybody's lost their mind it seems (generally speaking). So who gets to determine what's prudent? I'm serious.


Jane

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"Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour." Leviticus 19:15

If you want a serious answer.. I see NOTHING imprudent and certainly not negligent in GZ alerting LE to a stranger in a gated community... nor in his attempt to observe where that person went and what he was up to.

He did not deserve to be accosted nor attacked by TM



BTW I know a lot of people online DO carry guns themselves.

Putting aside ALL the build up... who pushed who first etc... if any of the gun carriers here would NOT have shot a person straddling them and beating their heads.... I suggest they STOP carrying their gun because they are just providing a weapon that might well be used by some bad guy against THEM!

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Jane I agree with you. I even wonder if knowing these little things from being married to a lawyer for 20 years, actually formed my opinion on this case as I watched the facts (we know of) unfold?

R... Hi!
Yes when I got my permit to "carry" that is what they told me, it could be used against me. Tremendous responsibility carrying a loaded gun with hollow point too!!!

Hmm once Z. changed over from his role of a man "going to the store" and to the Captain of the Neighborhood Watch Group (following Trayvon in his SUV), he should NOT have taken his gun with him when he got OUT of his SUV. That is the rule of ALL NWG's, Registered or not, I think. If he was obeying their laws, and NOT carrying, WOULD he have acted the same? OR do non Registered groups just make up their own rules? HOW MANY were in his group? One, two?

We really don't know WHO attacked WHO first do we? We have Z.'s story that Trayvon doubled back. That is his story. WHO really knows? Sounds strange to me. Trayvon, a black 17 year old, surely KNEW SOME people carry guns, and he had none. Dangerous - doubling back to confront one who MIGHT have a gun? Doesn't sound right to me. Could be self serving as defendants do - setting up for a self defense, SYG plea?

So much speculation, but since we are, maybe Trayvon SAW the gun - and that what turned what made this turn into a murder?And - - WHERE was the gun? Was it in Z.'s hand? NONE of us know! And we don't know what Z. said to Trayvon. We know he had just said "Those A** Ho**s always get away." Did he say something racial?? Something about Trayvon's mama? They can and do, you know. Sounds like a frustrated man to me. Not a good mind-set for a guy to have, running around with a gun. Look at the net result.
George probably healed in less than a week. (Some say broken nose, some say injured nose). You'd BETTER FIGHT if the opponent has a GUN! Trayvon, never - will heal.

I think I have read that Z mentored black boys. Someone told me he did that as part of his Court sentence.
As I always say, THIS is one big MESS!

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Is there a video of George's apology to the family in court?


Jane

_________________
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"Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour." Leviticus 19:15

Jane, when I have time I will try to look. Did you lookon www.youtube.com?

I read the apologoy was discussed between the lawyers, and Trayvon Martin's parents said they did NOT want one!

An apology would be self serving, making one look like a "good guy". We all know this.
He said on the 911 he thought the person was a teen I believe.
He said in his apology, he saidthat he thought the person was a couple years (few years?) younger than he is.

Jane, I looked it up for you.
http://youtu.be/8WW5i_86hdU

It really looks like all of us here, want the whole truth and nothing BUT the truth.

I like evidence - and forensics as I said before. They don't lie, people do.

http://youtu.be/8WW5i_86hdU

Here Jane.

Ooops sorry Jane. I didn't think it got through.

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Thanks for that link, Joni.

I think the apology was unemotional and a little stilted, but George showed exceptional patience with that mean prosecutor who kept beating him up over who-all he apologized to and what-all he said and when-all he apologized, etc. He sickened me. George was most respectful. That prosecutor even called what George did 'a crime', I think he said, "When you did that crime....", which of course has not yet been established.


Jane

_________________
­
"Ye shall do no unrighteousness in judgment: thou shalt not respect the person of the poor, nor honour the person of the mighty: but in righteousness shalt thou judge thy neighbour." Leviticus 19:15

Your welcome Jane.

Yes Cross Examination is always tough I think. Was he trying to say to G. you didn't say it earlier, why now? Now for the world to hear? I think that's where he was going... Prosecutors try to fight hard for the victim ... the dead person. They have no voice...
Sure wish this trial was behind us. I would like to know all the hard cold facts ... I really would!

George is very well prepared. I think he has a good lawyer. Nothing like that Bozo in the Casey Anthony Case eh? Wasn't he something - learning on the job - in court? I could believe it.

George Zimmerman may be working to bond out of jail again
Posted: 4:53 p.m. Thursday, June 14, 2012
Updated: 5:38 p.m. Thursday, June 14, 2012

The defense said it plans to call at least two witnesses at George Zimmerman's bond hearing later this month.
The witnesses are bond agents from Magic Bail Bonds, which posted Zimmerman's 150,000 bond the first time.

WFTV legal analyst Bill Shaeffer said that indicates to him that the defense is gearing up for a battle.

"Clearly, Mr. O'Mara wants to show that Zimmerman has abided by all conditions of release while he was on bond and that the bondsman is secure in writing yet another bond," Sheaffer said.

Zimmerman's lawyer, Mark O'Mara, told the judge at the first bond hearing that it was crucial to his defense that Zimmerman bond out of jail.


....more at link
http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/geo ... gai/nPWLM/

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

George Zimmerman Defense Team Receives Second Round of Discovery
on 15 June 2012.

Yesterday, the prosecution delivered a second round of discovery to the defense. The discovery package includes 7 compact discs and hundreds of pages of documents. It includes surveillance video, police radio transmissions, crime scene photos, 911 calls Mr. Zimmerman made prior to the night of the shooting, and more. The documents include a crime scene diagram, and additional reports from the Sanford Police Department, FDLE, and the FBI. According the June 1 ruling of the Court, the defense will have 30 days to review the discovery before it is made available to the public.

The discovery process is ongoing, and we expect additional discovery to be disclosed as the case develops.

http://gzlegalcase.com/

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

I am very glad more and more information is coming.

Probably none of us every want to form an opinon on this case, or any case when ALL the facts are not out yet. Maybe it's just human nature ... that we did?

Not sure, but somethings just didn't seem OK to me, or seem normal, or the actions of a careful, cautious guy.

It is a BIG responsiblity to be a gun owner, (I know - I am), and one must not take that privilege - lightly. Not only can it be taken from you and used on you, you could also kill an innocent person.

Yes Joni, some real info is always good

But........
I do find that a lot of the people clamouring for a "Doc Dump" are people who don't seem to read, or don't comprehend what they read.

At best, most have formulated a hypotheses about the case... and go through the information snooping for tid bits that support their preconceived notions, and they dismiss anything that tends to disprove their hypothesis.

Frowned upon in scientific research.. known as "Data Snooping"

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Hi R!

I will do my best to read. Sometimes it is really hard to find a lot of time.

Easy for me to find 5 minutes!

THANKS for all you do!