A rather interesting article on Oscar

http://www.theepochtimes.com/n3/694111- ... n-june-30/

Kelly Phelps, a senior lecturer in the public law department at the University of Cape Town and a legal expert observing the trial, said the psychiatric evaluation could affect both the verdict and, if Pistorius is convicted, the sentencing. She saw three possible outcomes:

— An “extreme” conclusion in which the panel decides Pistorius was unable to distinguish between right and wrong, or act in accordance with that understanding, because of an anxiety disorder when he killed Steenkamp. Such an outcome, according to Phelps, would result in a verdict of “not guilty by reason of mental illness.”

— The panel basically agrees with the defense witness, Dr. Merryll Vorster, who said Pistorius was able to distinguish between right and wrong but had the anxiety disorder, possibly bolstering Pistorius’ argument that he was acting in “putative self-defense” because he feared his life was in danger from a perceived intruder.

— The panel contradicts Vorster and says Pistorius does not have an anxiety disorder, possibly casting doubt on the defense’s argument that Pistorius had a long-held fear of crime and felt anxious and vulnerable when he shot Steenkamp.


The "scream" testimony IMO is crap.

I can't imagine what the evaluation will find but it will certainly be interesting.


And a big hello to Jelly and Steve

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

O as you all likely know the mob has no bloody idea what they are talking about when it comes to mental health. Google may be a king maker but there are 31 other pieces in a chess set and if you ask the "experts" a question they don't have a clue about any of them.

_________________
If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

I said from the first day of testimony that I don't see the "scream testimony" as a big deal.

It is a peculiarity of the SA system that allows witnesses to interpret rather than just testify to the what they heard (or saw)... but it is INTERPRETATION to say the screams were uttered by a woman.. especially in the case of Burger/Johnson who were so far away. We saw and heard Burger (in particular) embellish her testimony as she went along, especially in cross examination where she added "blood curdling"... in response to Roux questioning her and doubting her interpretation.
As I have stated many times now... human perception is about interpreting information rather than a machine like recording of information. Humans can, and often do misinterpret information. It is a normal human response to interpret based on past experience and expectations. Not a surprise that in the night, a high pitched distressed voice would be interpreted by many (all) observers as female screams.. one does not expect a man to emit high pitched wails.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

True Gossip Forum posters only THINK they are playing chess... they are in fact playing "Tiddly Winks"

Worrying at a piece of info here, then a piece there.. making them jump briefly, but making no progress.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

True Gossip Forum posters only THINK they are playing chess... they are in fact playing "Tiddly Winks"

Too true but they are more than internet posters on TGF they are intelligent "thought ful" poster (if I may quote).

Frankly I see a lot of pawns.

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

Thankfully Judge Masipa seems very well reasoned and able to discern why testimony late to the game is not as reliable as testimony immediately given, she will also be able to view the “scream” testimony with perspective, wisdom, and she seems to have the ability to view everything through the eyes of the law rather than emotional prejudice.

I don't think that the evaluation is a good thing for the state nor do I think Oscar's testimony was as bad as some believe it was.

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

I don't regard OP's testimony as "bad" for him. I would have been more worried if he was word perfect and cool (rehearsed and faking it)

Nel is an ass-hole, an interrogator, and nasty with it (IMO). I thought OP held up OK despite that. Nel saying that OP's answers do not make sense.. said more to me about how dim Nel was (or was pretending to be). For Nel to claim OP was tailoring his answers was a bit rich... coming from Nel who tailors his comprehension, and "version" of what the witness said... often what Nel wanted them to have said, rather than what they actually said. I know cross examination may well "test" a witness with a repeat similar questions, but Nel simply would not accept some answers and asked the same until he got an answer with a word or phrase he could latch on to. The Judge will see the entire transcript including all the reasonable answers as well as any "trap" answer Nel eventually elicited.

I also think Dixon did OK... he was there to put a range of topics before the court... and he did that. Of particular importance was a recording of a cricket bat on a door... sounding at least in the same "ball park" as a gunshot. As I mentioned above.. Nel is going to have to concede that his own witnesses were WRONG in their interpretation of at least some of the "Bangs" they were convinced were gunshots. The recording of the cricket bat hitting a door is key evidence to have before the court.. Dixon's evidence was invaluable for presenting that, if nothing else.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Media awaits Pistorius's arrival in hospital
Monday 26 May 2014 08:30

Several media houses have started gathering at the Weskoppies Psychiatric hospital in Pretoria west, ahead of the arrival of Oscar Pistorius.

North Gauteng High Court Judge, Thokozile Masipa, has ordered Pistorius to present himself by 9 o'clock on Monday morning for his first day of psychiatric observation.

This after the defence's expert witness, Dr. Meryll Vorster, testified that Pistorius suffers from a Generalised Anxiety Disorder
.
Journalists, photographers, camera crews and the international media are braving the winter cold, waiting for Pistorius to arrive.

...more at link
http://www.sabc.co.za/news/a/e60d468044 ... l-20140526

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Oscar Pistorius arrives for first day of psychiatric evaluation at mental health hospital
May 26, 2014 08:30
By Richard Hartley-Parkinson

The Blade runner will be seen by a team of four psychiatrists at Weskoppies Hospital, Pretoria

Oscar Pistorius has arrived at Weskoppies mental health hospital where he is to undergo psychiatric evaluation.

The Blade Runner was driven into the facility in a Chevrolet Sonic this morning and security around the hospital remains tight.

He will undergo tests to see if his Generalised Anxiety Disorder played any role in the shooting of girlfriend Reeva Steenkamp.

He will be monitored by four psychiatrists as an outpatient for 30 days, meaning he will have to visit every weekday for the next six weeks.

There was a chance that he might have been admitted as an inpatient, but he will report there daily from 9am until 4pm.

The tests that will be carried out on him are taking place to find out whether he was criminally responsible on the night he shot dead Reeva Steenkamp on February 14 last year.

The decision by Judge Thokozile Masipa followed a request for a psychiatric evaluation by chief prosecutor Gerrie Nel.

...more at link
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news ... ay-3608477

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

Pistorius starts psychiatric observation

PRETORIA - Oscar Pistorius reported to Weskoppies Psychiatric Hospital before 9am on Monday for day one of his court-ordered psychiatric observation.

Video at link
http://www.enca.com/south-africa/pistor ... bservation

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light

IMO

I agree that Nel is much more an interrogator than a prosecutor (at least in this case) it may make for good emotional persuasive showmanship for people that are less sophisticate in their thought process but I doubt that the good judge was swayed or duped by his bully tactics. Nel's tactics are what they use to obtain false confessions and would not be allowed here in the US.

Man, would I love to be a fly on the wall in those evaluation sessions. A lot will be learned from written multiple choice tests but the human interaction should be really interesting. IMO there is very little chance this is going to be a good outcome for the State. It is impossible to assess someone through a screen but it is clear that Oscar is unwell and after reading his book (including letters from his dad and brother at the end of the book) it is clear that he has had some mental health issue for a very long time IMEHO.

I really think his mind had to break in someway in order to reconcile the fact that he had to put on his legs but was never allowed to really feel different than other kids, I think it is great to live to our full potential, I think it is dangerous to not allow a boy to acknowledge he doesn't have legs from the knees down. I think that played demand to be "normal" played havoc with Oscars psyche and if I was so bold to guess at at any finding I would believe this dichotomy of reality and fantastic stoicism that Oscar was forced to live since he was an infant, had to have a detrimental effect him psychologically. A perfect storm of family, genetics, psychology and culture, created Oscar as he is today.

Doesn't excuse him if he shot Reeva on purpose, but I just don't see the evidence that he did so.

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If your mind is agitated you will find agitation everywhere. Where else will you find peace if not within you? __ Papaji

Absolutely, to all of the above, Carmelita and Rumpole :-D There are "rumours" there's a massive book deal, exclusive interviews and lucrative retirement package in it for Nel, if he acquires a "guilty" verdict.

How true? Dunno. But he's sure as hell acting/proving that to be the case . . . X

Brilliant- Steve and Rumpole! Comedy gold, along with the cricket monologue :-D Literally on the deck reading that! ROFL

One-sided argument - telephone convo? If it WAS Oscar and Reeva, for such an angry/irate man, he wasn't arguing back then, was he? Hmmmmm . . .

Oh, any thoughts on mysterious Frank BTW? I feel really sorry for him :-P

Thanks for all the links, Rumpole :-D

Bloomin 'eck! How intrusive was that, eh? Scary shit . .

And Burger who heard screams was asleep at the time. Her husband woke up and heard Oscar, then she only awoke when he got up :-P

Plus, what's with the closest neighbours hearing no screaming? I don't believe they've purposely lied on the stand, so they genuinely didn't hear screams, whilst others further away did??

That's a conundrum . . . ??

Haha. I've only just realised



*leaves room to look for last eye-test results*

Hi,

Frank is causing a bit of a stir due to his lack of involvement.

I have no doubt he'll be accused of being 'chief conspirator' to the whole thing. He'll have to fight for pole position though against Carice Stander, Mr Stander, Aimee, OP's close neighbours and a field mouse that was last seen heading towards the Palace of Justice in Pretoria - on a bike.

Hi Carmelita

Hope you're fine, and glad you're still maintaining a rational view on the aspects of the case.

Yep, the evaluation should be interesting. From what I can gather the assessment should be very detailed, although the feedback to the court in terms of a summary could be a very simple statement. i.e. we have reason to believe that OP did have a mental illness that may have contributed...

I'd expect there to be more detail read out to court though, purely in the interests of the court showing it's transparency to the public. I'm not thinking they would change procedure, or any aspect of law, more likely that if it's within Judge Masipa's remit to provide more detail from the report, she may well do so.

Hi, all

Nice to see the thread "ticking over"

There has tended to be too much "Rumpole".

I agree that it is obvious that OP has psychological/emotional issues. The panel is BOUND to find and report that. I do though repeat my concerns that psychiatric/psychological evaluation is "subjective". OP's "psychological state" at the time of the event is open to interpretation and then there is the LEGAL ramifications of the report whatever the report is. However, one has to "trust the experts" to some extent and by all accounts this panel is comprised of "experts" up to the task.
As I have said before, the trial and most of the line of evidence presented so far has been a bit of a waste of time. I think we have to accept that OP shot in some sort of a panic at what he thought was an intruder. The why's and wherefores of that, the legal consequences, and any mitigation should be what the trial was about. So... in hindsight I agree with those who have said that a psych evaluation of OP should have been done (and discussed) much earlier on.

_________________
Do not go gentle into that good night.
___________ Rage, rage against the dying of the light